The Alien Outsider

[kerravonsen]

In discussing the TV show meme we got talking about Aliens, and why do they always want to be human all the time. So I give ye all a challenge: tell me of some interesting aliens who don't want to be human, but are content to be just as alien as they are, while still interacting with humans. I expect one would get a lot more from books, though remember that the conditions of this search are aliens-that-are-working-with-humans, not ones that are content to be aliens because they're sitting off at home among their fellow aliens.

Here's my suggestions:

• The Doctor
  
• the occassional Vulcan who isn't Mr. Spock
  
• Cally
  
• the Tenctonese (in Alien Nation)
  
• Edger (giant turtle which turns up occassionally in the Liaden universe novels)
  

Comments

Pretty much...

[tptigger.livejournal.com]

...any alien in B5. Except for Delenn, but she has her own reasons. :)

Re: Pretty much...

[kerravonsen]

(gee, that was a fast response!)

Yes, I'd probably say that Delenn's reasons for becoming half-human are pretty laudable -- she doesn't do it because of a lack in herself, but for the sake of others. (Of course the problem with bridges is that they get walked on...)

[meril.livejournal.com]

You're right about finding more adjusted aliens in books. Unfortunately, the only ones I can think of are Silky from Joan Vinge's The Snow Queen, but it was hardly a major character. Oh, and Nimitz from the Honor Harrington series...(in his case, I think the goal may be to try to make the humans more alien...^_-)

[kerravonsen]

Nimitz is so cool. (grin)

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

Someone got there before me with B5, so I'll nominate Garak, who's a favourite anyway.

[kerravonsen]

Good point. And there's Dax as well, and I have to mention Quark even though he's (a) not likeable and (b) is more interested in fleecing humans than working with them. Have to exclude Kira, even though I do like her, because, well, she's hovering above her home planet.

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

Of course all these people are basically humans with bumps. There isn't that much different about them; many other cultures on this planet are much more strange to us.

[kerravonsen]

Yeah, they aren't very alien, are they?

[azarsuerte.livejournal.com]

I expect one would get a lot more from books,

Movies too--Chewbacca was very well adjusted. *grin*

Hmm...well-adjusted TV aliens. I don't think Teal'c has any *desire* to become human, I just think he's been influenced by hanging out with them so long. (And Chris Judge wants to act more human. *g*) ;-)

Definitely agree on most of the Vulcans other than Spock (and T'Pol :-P)--I adore Sarek and Saavik. :-) And while I wouldn't call Worf well-adjusted necessarily, I don't think he was trying to be human. I think he was trying *not* to be. Kes was pretty well-adjusted...well, until she went glowy. (That seems to have a negative effect on people--Kes, Cordelia...I didn't even like ascended!Daniel as much as the corporeal version: he made stupid choices and then Oma swooped in and erased the consequences. :-P *coughFullCirclecough*)

And hee...I think Jacob/Selmak are *very* well adjusted; it's just everyone around them who thinks they've been too influenced by each other. ;-)

Interesting topic...I have a feeling I'll be pondering this for a while. :-D

[kerravonsen]

I think Jacob/Selmak are *very* well adjusted; it's just everyone around them who thinks they've been too influenced by each other.

(grin) I love Jacob/Selmak, though I'm not sure whether they fit into the category, because half of the blending is human.

well, until she went glowy. (That seems to have a negative effect on people--Kes, Cordelia...I didn't even like ascended!Daniel as much as the corporeal version...

Neither did I. Well, I didn't like what I saw of what he was constrained to do -- all through watching "Abyss" with a friend, I kept on saying "Ascension sucks!" What sort of a "higher" being can one be, if the impulse to aid those one loves has to be stifled? It's as if they have all of the power and none of the wisdom. I don't think I've seen any "non corporeal" being in SF that I've liked, really. What's so great about being a glowy bit of light? Half the time they seem required to have no emotions, the other half they're all-powerful only to sit there and do nothing. Sure, it is a Bad Thing for an all-powerful being to interfere so much that they stomp on human free will, but y'know, they are allowed to do things if people ask, surely?

I figure that they're written so badly because the writers don't understand God.

[azarsuerte.livejournal.com]

(grin) I love Jacob/Selmak, though I'm not sure whether they fit into the category, because half of the blending is human.

True. But still, you hear the Tok'ra complain that he's *too* human, and some of the folks at the SGC sometimes think he's too Tok'ra, so... ;-)

Neither did I. Well, I didn't like what I saw of what he was constrained to do -- all through watching "Abyss" with a friend, I kept on saying "Ascension sucks!" What sort of a "higher" being can one be, if the impulse to aid those one loves has to be stifled? It's as if they have all of the power and none of the wisdom. I don't think I've seen any "non corporeal" being in SF that I've liked, really. What's so great about being a glowy bit of light? Half the time they seem required to have no emotions, the other half they're all-powerful only to sit there and do nothing. Sure, it is a Bad Thing for an all-powerful being to interfere so much that they stomp on human free will, but y'know, they are allowed to do things if people ask, surely?

I figure that they're written so badly because the writers don't understand God.

The funny thing is, I actually *love* the Ancients themselves, I just didn't like Ascended!Daniel. I like Oma Desala, and I adored Orlin. :-) I think the Ancients have been at this long enough that they're wise enough to know they *can't* use their powers wisely when it comes to intervening in mortal affairs. Daniel wasn't, and his ties to his friends were still strong. Plus, it just wasn't in his nature to sit back and do nothing, and I'm surprised it took him as long as it did to realize that, especially when the *reason* he ascended in the first place was so he could "do more."

It's like...look at the Greek and Roman gods. Whom, we're supposed to assume in the Stargate universe, may have been the Ancients. Some of them were Goa'uld (or Tok'ra--namely Egeria), but since the Ancient language is a predecessor of Latin, it's logical to assume that most of them were Ancients. For example, even though Oma Desala's name when we meet her isn't Latin (I don't think), the concept of Mother Nature is present there too--Demeter, Ceres, Gaia, etc. And going by Greek/Roman mythology...the gods abused their power *horribly*. I mean look at Zeus--here he is the KING of the gods, and he can't keep it in his pants. *sigh* Maybe the rest of them--like Orlin--learned the lesson of interfering the hard way.

So I guess to me...I see the Ancients as being aware that they're *not* gods, hence the limitations they place on themselves. God is all-knowing, all-powerful, *and* all-good. The Ascended may be "above" mortals, but they're still imperfect. But it takes experience--millenia of it, apparently--to become wise enough to realize where you're *not* wise. :-) Kes and Daniel never reached that point. And Cordy...well, Cordy's situation was never exactly good to begin with--she got tricked into ascending so Jasmine could hijack her body and give birth to herself. So that would invalidate any wisdom she did gain right there. ;-)

*shrug* That's my take on it, anyway.